There won't be any play-offs
- Thread starter CroJack
- Start date
CroJack
Key Player
A couple of minutes ago all of this has become official. F*** off.
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"A joint statement released by all 12 founding clubs can be found below, with further information being made available in due course.
We are committed to working with all stakeholders, particularly supporters, as plans for the competition develop.
Twelve of Europe’s leading football clubs have today come together to announce they have agreed to establish a new mid-week competition, the Super League, governed by its Founding Clubs.
AC Milan, Arsenal FC, Atlético de Madrid, Chelsea FC, FC Barcelona, FC Internazionale Milano, Juventus FC, Liverpool FC, Manchester City, Manchester United, Real Madrid CF and Tottenham Hotspur have all joined as Founding Clubs. It is anticipated that a further three clubs will join ahead of the inaugural season, which is intended to commence as soon as practicable.
Going forward, the Founding Clubs look forward to holding discussions with UEFA and FIFA to work together in partnership to deliver the best outcomes for the new League and for football as a whole.
The formation of the Super League comes at a time when the global pandemic has accelerated the instability in the existing European football economic model. Further, for a number of years, the Founding Clubs have had the objective of improving the quality and intensity of existing European competitions throughout each season, and of creating a format for top clubs and players to compete on a regular basis.
The pandemic has shown that a strategic vision and a sustainable commercial approach are required to enhance value and support for the benefit of the entire European football pyramid. In recent months extensive dialogue has taken place with football stakeholders regarding the future format of European competitions. The Founding Clubs believe the solutions proposed following these talks do not solve fundamental issues, including the need to provide higher-quality matches and additional financial resources for the overall football pyramid.
Competition Format
The new annual tournament will provide significantly greater economic growth and support for European football via a long-term commitment to uncapped solidarity payments which will grow in line with league revenues. These solidarity payments will be substantially higher than those generated by the current European competition and are expected to be in excess of €10 billion during the course of the initial commitment period of the Clubs. In addition, the competition will be built on a sustainable financial foundation with all Founding Clubs signing up to a spending framework. In exchange for their commitment, Founding Clubs will receive an amount of €3.5 billion solely to support their infrastructure investment plans and to offset the impact of the COVID pandemic.
Florentino Pérez, President Real Madrid CF and the first Chairman of the Super League said:
“We will help football at every level and take it to its rightful place in the world. Football is the only global sport in the world with more than four billion fans and our responsibility as big clubs is to respond to their desires.”
Backing the new European league, Andrea Agnelli, Chairman of Juventus and Vice-Chairman of the Super League said:
“Our 12 Founder clubs represent billions of fans across the globe and 99 European trophies. We have come together at this critical moment, enabling European competition to be transformed, putting the game we love on a sustainable footing for the long-term future, substantially increasing solidarity, and giving fans and amateur players a regular flow of headline fixtures that will feed their passion for the game while providing them with engaging role models.”
Joel Glazer, Co-Chairman of Manchester United and Vice-Chairman of the Super League said:
“By bringing together the world’s greatest clubs and players to play each other throughout the season, the Super League will open a new chapter for European football, ensuring world-class competition and facilities, and increased financial support for the wider football pyramid.”
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Once again, f*** off.
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"A joint statement released by all 12 founding clubs can be found below, with further information being made available in due course.
We are committed to working with all stakeholders, particularly supporters, as plans for the competition develop.
Twelve of Europe’s leading football clubs have today come together to announce they have agreed to establish a new mid-week competition, the Super League, governed by its Founding Clubs.
AC Milan, Arsenal FC, Atlético de Madrid, Chelsea FC, FC Barcelona, FC Internazionale Milano, Juventus FC, Liverpool FC, Manchester City, Manchester United, Real Madrid CF and Tottenham Hotspur have all joined as Founding Clubs. It is anticipated that a further three clubs will join ahead of the inaugural season, which is intended to commence as soon as practicable.
Going forward, the Founding Clubs look forward to holding discussions with UEFA and FIFA to work together in partnership to deliver the best outcomes for the new League and for football as a whole.
The formation of the Super League comes at a time when the global pandemic has accelerated the instability in the existing European football economic model. Further, for a number of years, the Founding Clubs have had the objective of improving the quality and intensity of existing European competitions throughout each season, and of creating a format for top clubs and players to compete on a regular basis.
The pandemic has shown that a strategic vision and a sustainable commercial approach are required to enhance value and support for the benefit of the entire European football pyramid. In recent months extensive dialogue has taken place with football stakeholders regarding the future format of European competitions. The Founding Clubs believe the solutions proposed following these talks do not solve fundamental issues, including the need to provide higher-quality matches and additional financial resources for the overall football pyramid.
Competition Format
- 20 participating clubs with 15 Founding Clubs and a qualifying mechanism for a further five teams to qualify annually based on achievements in the prior season.
- Midweek fixtures with all participating clubs continuing to compete in their respective national leagues, preserving the traditional domestic match calendar which remains at the heart of the club game.
- An August start with clubs participating in two groups of ten, playing home and away fixtures, with the top three in each group automatically qualifying for the quarter finals. Teams finishing fourth and fifth will then compete in a two-legged play-off for the remaining quarter-final positions. A two-leg knockout format will be used to reach the final at the end of May, which will be staged as a single fixture at a neutral venue.
The new annual tournament will provide significantly greater economic growth and support for European football via a long-term commitment to uncapped solidarity payments which will grow in line with league revenues. These solidarity payments will be substantially higher than those generated by the current European competition and are expected to be in excess of €10 billion during the course of the initial commitment period of the Clubs. In addition, the competition will be built on a sustainable financial foundation with all Founding Clubs signing up to a spending framework. In exchange for their commitment, Founding Clubs will receive an amount of €3.5 billion solely to support their infrastructure investment plans and to offset the impact of the COVID pandemic.
Florentino Pérez, President Real Madrid CF and the first Chairman of the Super League said:
“We will help football at every level and take it to its rightful place in the world. Football is the only global sport in the world with more than four billion fans and our responsibility as big clubs is to respond to their desires.”
Backing the new European league, Andrea Agnelli, Chairman of Juventus and Vice-Chairman of the Super League said:
“Our 12 Founder clubs represent billions of fans across the globe and 99 European trophies. We have come together at this critical moment, enabling European competition to be transformed, putting the game we love on a sustainable footing for the long-term future, substantially increasing solidarity, and giving fans and amateur players a regular flow of headline fixtures that will feed their passion for the game while providing them with engaging role models.”
Joel Glazer, Co-Chairman of Manchester United and Vice-Chairman of the Super League said:
“By bringing together the world’s greatest clubs and players to play each other throughout the season, the Super League will open a new chapter for European football, ensuring world-class competition and facilities, and increased financial support for the wider football pyramid.”
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Once again, f*** off.
IanABS94
Key Player
Fucking Utter Cunts. Excuse me for swearing but this is an absolute disgrace. Utter disgrace. I can't wait for it to fail with support from fans dwindling to nothing in a few years time once the novelty has worn off. I hope they are never allowed in a UEFA competition again and I hope players refuse to play in it.
GREED and nothing else but pure GREED. I've been following this since it broke and my respect for Gary Neville has increased ten-fold after listening to what he had to say tonight. He was backed up by Roy Keane, Micah Richards, Dion Dublin and Danny Murphy amongst others.
It's late now but I'll have a lot more to say on this. The British clubs involved should now be instantly relegated to the bottom tier of English football and their entire history wiped from the annals of British football. Further, ANY footballer playing for ANY of these teams should A) never be allowed to play in our system again and B) never be selected for their national teams. I can't begin to tell you how much this absolutely sickens me.
It's late now but I'll have a lot more to say on this. The British clubs involved should now be instantly relegated to the bottom tier of English football and their entire history wiped from the annals of British football. Further, ANY footballer playing for ANY of these teams should A) never be allowed to play in our system again and B) never be selected for their national teams. I can't begin to tell you how much this absolutely sickens me.
Yankee_Jack
Key Player
Football as we know it, has changed forever.
this is going to be about branding ... the Greed League is the new unofficial brand.
there is a bubble in media rights in football. It is about to burst. I will not follow the agreed League and will not watch it.
Sport across the board is finding that advertising spots are being filled with dead air during live events: F1 racing, Championship match’s (our matches on ESPN/Sky for example), tennis, etc. I don’t watch Prem matches anymore because the only way they generate revenue in the USA now is behind a paywall. Without eyeballs there is no revenue.
Eyeballs do not watch midweek matches aired during work hours in the USA (I’m probably the exception, but I have total control over my hours). If the new greed league will play midweek? Then it’s financially DOA.
this is going to be about branding ... the Greed League is the new unofficial brand.
there is a bubble in media rights in football. It is about to burst. I will not follow the agreed League and will not watch it.
Sport across the board is finding that advertising spots are being filled with dead air during live events: F1 racing, Championship match’s (our matches on ESPN/Sky for example), tennis, etc. I don’t watch Prem matches anymore because the only way they generate revenue in the USA now is behind a paywall. Without eyeballs there is no revenue.
Eyeballs do not watch midweek matches aired during work hours in the USA (I’m probably the exception, but I have total control over my hours). If the new greed league will play midweek? Then it’s financially DOA.
CroJack
Key Player
If they get banned from UEFA and FIFA and relegated or kicked out from their respective leagues, then football is not dead. On the contrary.
And the name European Super League? Four countries are not Europe. This has nothing to do with football and the very essence of the football we all know and love, and that essence is competition. Highs and lows. Laughter and tears.
One day their 'European Super League' will become 'World Super League', and it will be nothing but a new Harlem Globetrotters.
And the name European Super League? Four countries are not Europe. This has nothing to do with football and the very essence of the football we all know and love, and that essence is competition. Highs and lows. Laughter and tears.
One day their 'European Super League' will become 'World Super League', and it will be nothing but a new Harlem Globetrotters.
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Yankee_Jack
Key Player
If the Greed League is going to play midweek .... then what do they expect to do on a Saturday. Are the players going to sit around and watch their non-black-balled counter parts or do these clubs expect to continue to field a team in their national premier leagues!?! Are they fucking nuts!
Who is going to permit that to happen?
Who is going to permit that to happen?
Behindthegoal
Key Player
The Champions League, under this scheme is de facto deceased.
I can’t see the Super League winning this one
I can’t see the Super League winning this one
Yankee_Jack
Key Player
If the Champions League fails - three things will result:
UEFA will not let the Champions League fail - it is their crown jewel at the club level. It will have to continue to operate the competition - perhaps under some compromise and challenge initially as it battles for media ratings - but that is a branding challenge thing and also a media rights issue. Media companies that carry the Super League would lose their rights for other UEFA and national league competitions - in other words they would be black-balled. There have to be non-compete clauses in media contracts and there would have to be other cancellation clauses that the leagues etc could trigger ... there will always be takers for media rights all be it at a discounted rate since national leagues provide a platform for advertisers to national audiences.
Then there's club licensing ... ordinarily, each governing entity in the pyramid (league, national association, confederation) grants a club a license to compete. A Prem club is licensed by the EPL, then licensed by the FA, then if they play in Champions League or Europa they are licensed by UEFA. Similarly, for us, we are licensed by the Championship, then by the FA ... then in the event we win the FA or league Cup and play in Europa we would be licensed by UEFA. These governing bodies would have to cancel licenses or submit to the Super League. In the UK, the FA would also through the appropriate pyramid deny licenses to the clubs to play in the various development leagues (e.g. U-23 etc) in the UK and so disenfranchise the academies.
The only way the Super League operates is as a non-licensed entity - surely UEFA would not license - therefore they would be outlaws unless FIFA extends a license.
To further fuck things up ... this might be a way for Celtic and Rangers to enter the English league system as a replacement club into the EPL. It could become dog eat dog in the UK.
- money due the minor prem league clubs in various countries (e.g. AJax, Celtic/Ranger etc) will cease - this is Celtics "profit money" per their budget
- Europa League drop-ins from the best of the rest in the group stage will disappear
- FIFA World Club competition will be without a European club unless FIFA grants recognition and takes the top club from the Super League - a big FU to UEFA
UEFA will not let the Champions League fail - it is their crown jewel at the club level. It will have to continue to operate the competition - perhaps under some compromise and challenge initially as it battles for media ratings - but that is a branding challenge thing and also a media rights issue. Media companies that carry the Super League would lose their rights for other UEFA and national league competitions - in other words they would be black-balled. There have to be non-compete clauses in media contracts and there would have to be other cancellation clauses that the leagues etc could trigger ... there will always be takers for media rights all be it at a discounted rate since national leagues provide a platform for advertisers to national audiences.
Then there's club licensing ... ordinarily, each governing entity in the pyramid (league, national association, confederation) grants a club a license to compete. A Prem club is licensed by the EPL, then licensed by the FA, then if they play in Champions League or Europa they are licensed by UEFA. Similarly, for us, we are licensed by the Championship, then by the FA ... then in the event we win the FA or league Cup and play in Europa we would be licensed by UEFA. These governing bodies would have to cancel licenses or submit to the Super League. In the UK, the FA would also through the appropriate pyramid deny licenses to the clubs to play in the various development leagues (e.g. U-23 etc) in the UK and so disenfranchise the academies.
The only way the Super League operates is as a non-licensed entity - surely UEFA would not license - therefore they would be outlaws unless FIFA extends a license.
To further fuck things up ... this might be a way for Celtic and Rangers to enter the English league system as a replacement club into the EPL. It could become dog eat dog in the UK.
Yankee_Jack
Key Player
So apparently .... the ESL clubs do expect to play in their national prem leagues on a Saturday.
There is going to be a pissing content of biblical proportion. Over / Under ... who's going to blink first.
There is going to be a pissing content of biblical proportion. Over / Under ... who's going to blink first.
The Greed League have already instructed their legal eagles to challenge any attempt to 'unfairly' bar their member clubs from their respective domestic leagues. This is gonna become tasty but the Greeds should not be allowed to win. Boris has expressed his opposition to them and, in this instance, I would be more than happy to see government intervention in sport.
As I type, I believe that PSG, Bayern Munich and Borussia Dortmund have yet to sign up and there's a fair chance they won't. If this happens it will totally devalue this new competition. As it stands, I've been listening to Talk Sport (and the phone-ins throughout the day) and there is MASSIVE opposition to the Greeds even from the supporters of the so-called 'Big Six'. They are as disgusted as everyone else. Good for them.
The whole concept beggars belief. The avaricious American owners, as ever only concerned with chasing the big buck for themselves irrespective of the damage it would do to anyone else, want a closed shop to add even more money to their already bulging pockets. Greedy bastards, imo. By the way, look at the present league positions here. Arsenal Big Six? Spurs Big Six? I think not. West Ham and Leicester might have views on that!!!!!
More later but in the meantime I will be rooting for Leeds to smash Liverpool out of sight tonight. And from now on in I hope that the 'little teams' will take umbrage and play to show the Big Six teams that they're not as big as they obviously think they are. Yanks, fuck off home and, if you could take our useless lot with you, that would be a helluva result.
As I type, I believe that PSG, Bayern Munich and Borussia Dortmund have yet to sign up and there's a fair chance they won't. If this happens it will totally devalue this new competition. As it stands, I've been listening to Talk Sport (and the phone-ins throughout the day) and there is MASSIVE opposition to the Greeds even from the supporters of the so-called 'Big Six'. They are as disgusted as everyone else. Good for them.
The whole concept beggars belief. The avaricious American owners, as ever only concerned with chasing the big buck for themselves irrespective of the damage it would do to anyone else, want a closed shop to add even more money to their already bulging pockets. Greedy bastards, imo. By the way, look at the present league positions here. Arsenal Big Six? Spurs Big Six? I think not. West Ham and Leicester might have views on that!!!!!
More later but in the meantime I will be rooting for Leeds to smash Liverpool out of sight tonight. And from now on in I hope that the 'little teams' will take umbrage and play to show the Big Six teams that they're not as big as they obviously think they are. Yanks, fuck off home and, if you could take our useless lot with you, that would be a helluva result.
CroJack
Key Player
Thumbs up for Boris Johnson and Oliver Dowden.
Two leading Government officials have already spoken out against the European Super League plans.
'I don’t like the look of these proposals, and we’ll be consulted about what we can do,’ said Prime Minister Boris Johnson.
'We are going to look at everything that we can do with the football authorities to make sure that this doesn’t go ahead in the way that it’s currently being proposed.
'I don’t think that it’s good news for fans, I don’t think it’s good news for football in this country.
'These clubs are not just great global brands – of course they’re great global brands – they are also clubs that have originated historically from their towns, from their cities, from their local communities. They should have a link with those fans, and with the fanbase in their community.
'So it is very, very important that that continues to be the case.'
On Sunday, Culture Secretary Oliver Dowden said: 'Football supporters are the heartbeat of our national sport and any major decisions made should have their backing.
'With many fans, we are concerned that this plan could create a closed shop at the very top of our national game. Sustainability, integrity and fair competition are absolutely paramount and anything that undermines this is deeply troubling and damaging for football.
'We have a football pyramid where funds from the globally successful Premier League flow down the leagues and into local communities. I would be bitterly disappointed to see any action that destroys that.'
Two leading Government officials have already spoken out against the European Super League plans.
'I don’t like the look of these proposals, and we’ll be consulted about what we can do,’ said Prime Minister Boris Johnson.
'We are going to look at everything that we can do with the football authorities to make sure that this doesn’t go ahead in the way that it’s currently being proposed.
'I don’t think that it’s good news for fans, I don’t think it’s good news for football in this country.
'These clubs are not just great global brands – of course they’re great global brands – they are also clubs that have originated historically from their towns, from their cities, from their local communities. They should have a link with those fans, and with the fanbase in their community.
'So it is very, very important that that continues to be the case.'
On Sunday, Culture Secretary Oliver Dowden said: 'Football supporters are the heartbeat of our national sport and any major decisions made should have their backing.
'With many fans, we are concerned that this plan could create a closed shop at the very top of our national game. Sustainability, integrity and fair competition are absolutely paramount and anything that undermines this is deeply troubling and damaging for football.
'We have a football pyramid where funds from the globally successful Premier League flow down the leagues and into local communities. I would be bitterly disappointed to see any action that destroys that.'
KVetch
Key Player
Wew would be utter madness If we got promoted this way. They have been plotting this Super League for years now. Very underhanded the way they did this. I hadn't heard anything about it recently. What a greedy idea. Liverpool's own players are speaking out against it. Greedy owners. Now we are relying on the greed of UEFA and Boris Johnson to maintain the League.
I would say the Premier would be more interesting and competitive like the Championship without the top 6. But not this way. Would be horrible for football. I don't know any fans who support this move.
PSG and Bayern won't be a part of the Super League either. No Mbappe no Neymar Jr.
I would say the Premier would be more interesting and competitive like the Championship without the top 6. But not this way. Would be horrible for football. I don't know any fans who support this move.
PSG and Bayern won't be a part of the Super League either. No Mbappe no Neymar Jr.
Yankee_Jack
Key Player
Let's not look a gift horse in the mouth. I see no reason why the EPL would want to play second fiddle to a ESL ... demote the 6 -clubs (if the EFL will have them) and promote 6 from the EFL. It will penalize the clubs in revenue terms from their domestic competition. Now that Brexit is done ... none of the non-UK players playing for these clubs can play without some form of immigration exemption ... eliminate that. There are all sorts of penalties that the EPL and the FA and Whitehall can apply. The EPL could vote a limit on the number of overseas players per club ... to say none ... won't hurt Burnley much if at all but it would cripple City and United and Chelsea.
It wouldn't help Spurs, Arsenal and Liverpool much either!! I notice the gutless bastards chose their moment well when crowds are non-existent because of Covid. Had fans been present there would have been pitch invasions and protests all over the shop. As it is, Liverpool fans are removing banners from Anfield already. Now hearing that sanctions proposed by EUFA and FIFA such as preventing players representing their country and relegating offending clubs, might well be illegal and will be challenged in the courts. Let's hope the government gets involved and tweaks some laws to clip their wings.
Yankee_Jack
Key Player
The FA and the EPL are private entities. They can amend their bye-laws and operating regulations as and when the want. Leagues and Associations can refuse to recognize player registrations ... Bosman was about the labor going where it pleases, not a mandate that they have to be employed where they want, when they want. A club could hire a player, but not be able to play them in a competition because that competition fails to recognize the registration.
A club might litigate but that could take years .... it's been 5 years since HJ screwed us over and look where that is.
In the meantime, the club is losing money, the spectators are getting pissed off, the ESL folds because ... let's face it, to pay silly money, media companies have to either sell advertising slots (which is a declining asset base) or only enable viewing through a subscription or paywall (also a diminishing proposition for advertisers). And people need to have sufficient disposable income to pay to see a sham league run by greedy clubs. The notion that somehow people in Latvia or France or Switzerland or Norway are going to pay to see City v Juventus is ridiculous ... perhaps once, the first time, but on a continuing basis not so much.
CroJack
Key Player
As a lawyer, I want to make this clear:
1. Founding a new European Super League is not illegal according to the existing judicial practice. There are many different boxing organisations/associations, and nothing prevents the rich clubs to found separate leagues and even found their own World Soccer Association, European Soccer Association, South American Soccer Association etc. I assume they will be calling it soccer and not football
.2. FIFA and UEFA can't prevent players who will be playing in the new European Super League representing their countries at the European and World Cup. Players are free to work for whoever employs them, and if different leagues exist, FIFA and UEFA won't be able to prevent them to play for their countries in tournaments organised by FIFA and UEFA.
3. The national FA can kick out the offending clubs from their league system. Or relegate them. The national FA are organisations who have their own rules, and any member can be either punished or kicked out for breaking the rules. The new European Super League is a competition to the national FA, and you certainly don't want to have members who are undermining your organisation and its existence. Would Tories tolerate members who spread communist ideas? Would Labour tolerate members who support abolishment of the basic workers' rights? No.
4. FIFA can kick out the offending clubs from the FIFA Club World Cup. No problem here.
5. UEFA can kick out the offending clubs from all European competitions played under UEFA. No problem here either.
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Yankee_Jack
Key Player
@CroJack - under #2, since UEFA would be one of the parties organizing an international tournament then surely UEFA, any confederation for that matter, could restrict the players available for selection or registered to play in a tournament.
The employer would be the country's national federation; who could certainly employ a player or not at will, but their utilization (registration to play) in the tournament is controlled by the tournament organizer (e.g. UEFA).
The employer would be the country's national federation; who could certainly employ a player or not at will, but their utilization (registration to play) in the tournament is controlled by the tournament organizer (e.g. UEFA).