What do you think of Steve Cooper now?

[CroJack]

We've played some good football during the pre-season and Steve Cooper has, in my opinion, passed the test.

Not only we continue to play passing football from the back but we also:

• press more and try to recover the ball when out of possession
• commit more bodies up front
• defend set pieces differently than last season by a) man marking and b) having a man at the far post (Halleluja!!!)
• use the experience more than the youth
• play players in their natural position. No more wasting Grimes at left-back.
• play at higher tempo

So, what are your thoughts?

 

[Yankee_Jack]

Our opposition to date has been of a much lower standard than we will face this Saturday and with Hull et al going forward.

We should be expected to execute fluidly and successfully against such opposition. I am not overly impressed by the performance of some of our players. I expected to see more especially since they have the luxury to start with a clean slate and impress. McKay has looked to be one of our better players .... does that speak well for him, or badly for the rest of them.

We have added one middling LB. An improvement to the squad ... really, not so much. Meanwhile, we've been shedding players like a dog with fleas. Our inability to acquire any player of value is so lame that we actually gave Borja playing time and we know he'll be gone as soon as his agent finds a place for him to land. And, we still have the same two keepers ... please god ... vaccinate them against crosses, give them a back bone, and let's try to help out our two CBs. We are going into the season with 1 and only 1 experienced / seasoned CB - the others are still maturing (Roden) or brand new to senior football. McB has been reported listening to an interest and clubs have been reported as expressing an interest ... so who knows what will happen to him before the transfer window ends and his big buddy James is now in a position to report directly how much greener the grass can be. And, how much playing time has his back-up CBR seen ... basically next to nothing.

In other words, our squad is rife with risk. I don't hear of Cooper expressing any hope that his squad will be strengthened ... he's been praying that one of last season's U23 will magically blossom in front of his eyes.

The first acid test is against Atalanta. I'll opine further at the end of August. By then we'll see whether we've taken a step forward and have the grist for a promotion challenge or have another muddling, middling season in front of us. We'll also have a very good indication of whether Cooper has the chops to manage a senior level match, prepare his squad for it, and deal with the adversity that the opposition, match officials, money pinching executives and other acts of god can bring.

Is Cooper more like Sousa (produces a silk purse from a sows ear) or like Clement / BoBo / Monk ... talks the game but can't walk it.

 

[ivoralljack]

Two different slants on Cooper both making some good points. This has to be a quick response, so I'll just say that thus far Cooper has impressed with his team in games we should have expected them to impress. But they can only play what's in front of them where often the opposition's lowly status does nothing to bring the best out of our players.

Atalanta will be the litmus test having finished, I think, third in Serie A. Whilst it will still be a friendly, the quality of the opposition is such that they'll prove a stern test for us. For obvious reasons neither team will be going gung-ho at it but, nevertheless, they are a top team and it will be interesting to see how the lads shape up.

 

[Borini]

I am a tad worried after the rovers game. First ' quality' opposition and we were back to slow transitions again, ... Why did our new left back fail to belt forward into the massive gaps in front of him? . Overall pleased with what looks like a better press and faster transition.Corners... Man for man and someone on the far post... Still no one left up field for an out ball though.

 

[ivoralljack]

I am a tad worried after the rovers game. First ' quality' opposition and we were back to slow transitions again, ... Why did our new left back fail to belt forward into the massive gaps in front of him? . Overall pleased with what looks like a better press and faster transition.Corners... Man for man and someone on the far post... Still no one left up field for an out ball though.

This bothered me as well. There were many opportunities for Bidwell to attack the space down the left and he is supposed to be able to deliver a decent cross when he gets to the line. Hopefully this will be picked up on in the post game analysis.

 

[CroJack]

I am a tad worried after the rovers game. First ' quality' opposition and we were back to slow transitions again...

30° C on the pitch is not an ideal environment for the quick transitions.

Why did our new left back fail to belt forward into the massive gaps in front of him? .

As far as I remember I've posted in other thread my analysis of our new left-back. To make it short, he lacks pace and defensive discipline. John, although not an ideal solution, is better than Bidwell imho.

Our opposition to date has been of a much lower standard than we will face this Saturday and with Hull et al going forward.

'Low standard' can be tricky as we witnessed last season against poor Championship teams who beat us because we couldn't a) finish them off and b) defend set pieces. So far we have scored 17 goals during pre-season amd conceded only one from a set piece.

We should be expected to execute fluidly and successfully against such opposition

Which we did apart from the last game when players obviously struggled with the heat on the pitch.

I am not overly impressed by the performance of some of our players. I expected to see more especially since they have the luxury to start with a clean slate and impress.

This is still pre-season and we can't expect full throttle football.

We are going into the season with 1 and only 1 experienced / seasoned CB - the others are still maturing (Roden) or brand new to senior football.

We'll sign Ben Wilmot from Watford on loan. He's young but he's got some impressive stats, especially number of interceptions and progressive passes.

We'll also have a very good indication of whether Cooper has the chops to manage a senior level match,

I thought all pre-season matches were the senior level ones???

Is Cooper more like Sousa (produces a silk purse from a sows ear) or like Clement / BoBo / Monk ... talks the game but can't walk it.

I am surprised you can't see that the passing and attacking football we play under Cooper has nothing to do with the Clement's cowardly defensive , BoBo' total mess and Monk's hoof-it-to-the-lump football. If Cooper sorts out set pieces defending, better pressing and adds more physicality then he will be an upgrade on Potter.

Atalanta will be the litmus test having finished, I think, third in Serie A. Whilst it will still be a friendly, the quality of the opposition is such that they'll prove a stern test for us.

We proved last season that we can play excellent football against top teams, and Manchester City are top of the top. So, Atalanta should be a piece of cake. Our players are going to enjoy 21° C on Saturday in Swansea and Atalanta won't see the ball for 90 minutes.

 

[Yankee_Jack]

I thought all pre-season matches were the senior level ones???

By senior level I meant competitive matches that count to league position without players of all ages being swapped in and out. Matches where finesse and deftness of game management, tactical shifts and substitution, can make the pivotal difference between winning or losing. For example, Potter it can be said was, despite the odd fart here and there, pretty good in this area.

 

[Jackflash]

By senior level I meant competitive matches that count to league position without players of all ages being swapped in and out. Matches where finesse and deftness of game management, tactical shifts and substitution, can make the pivotal difference between winning or losing. For example, Potter it can be said was, despite the odd fart here and there, pretty good in this area.

Exactly Yankee, these are the games where we will give our judgement on Potter.

 

[CroJack]

Exactly Yankee, these are the games where we will give our judgement on Potter.

You mean Cooper? You are forgiven, it's really difficult to distinguish Potter's from Cooper's style of play .

 

[CroJack]

By senior level I meant competitive matches that count to league position without players of all ages being swapped in and out. Matches where finesse and deftness of game management, tactical shifts and substitution, can make the pivotal difference between winning or losing. For example, Potter it can be said was, despite the odd fart here and there, pretty good in this area.

I get your point @Yankee_Jack and I agree that game management, tactical shifts and substitutions are important to some extent but the whole point of being dominant in possession, dominating games and creating many chances is that opposition have little time to damage you. Then you don't need game management and tactical shifts, and substitutions are used just to freshen things up. Game management will be extremmely important for opposing managers who will have to figure out how to stop Swansea being dominant and how not to concede too many goals against us.

 

[Jackflash]

By senior level I meant competitive matches that count to league position without players of all ages being swapped in and out. Matches where finesse and deftness of game management, tactical shifts and substitution, can make the pivotal difference between winning or losing. For example, Potter it can be said was, despite the odd fart here and there, pretty good in this area.

Exactly Yankee, these are the games where we will give our judgement on Potter.

You mean Cooper? You are forgiven, it's really difficult to distinguish Potter's from Cooper's style of play .

Thanks CJ My point was who is to say all or any previous managers couldn't have got similar results from that opposition, its the opposition that allow your system to be successful or not at that level. I think as Ivor says the real test will be top 3 in Serie A club Atalanta, hopefully they wont underestimate us and put out a second team.

 

[CroJack]

 

[jackodiamonds]

Gotta say, I'm with CJ on Cooper. Man-marking and a guy on the post at set-pieces alone is a huge improvement - I honestly think Swansea would have been in the playoff picture if they'd have defended set-pieces even averagely well last season. Cooper also presses more, and seems happy to nail his guys into their positions and roles. As much as I enjoyed Potter's fluidity, it's hard to ask a Championship squad to be as tactically conversant as the '74 Dutch team Having a clear-cut job to do can only benefit the individual players.

As for the senior squad argument - no disrespect to contrary opinions, but I don't see the issue. Cooper won the World Cup at under-17's level - it's not like he was coaching 9 year olds. That age group are one step away from "senior" level, and look at the players Cooper had - the likes of Foden, Sessegnon and Hudson-Odoi would walk into most Premier League teams right now, much less a Championship team.

In other words, he's coached high-talent players and won a serious trophy with them which gives his tactics and man-management credibility. The hardest part for a so-called "unproven" coach like Cooper is getting the players to take him seriously. On the evidence so far, they definitely are. He even got a goal out of Borja

 

[Yankee_Jack]

Clement won a ton of trophies as a side kick to Ancelotti with all of the big clubs. BoBo had been around the block a few times too.

Seeing a bunch of kids every 90 days or so, and winning a youth tournament is not the same as running a club through the rigors of a league season against tough opposition with seasoned managers with multiple matches per week, complicated by biased officials, inclement weather, injuries, suspensions, interfering executives, asshole agents ... and so on.

It's all much easier said than done. Monk thought it was much easier done than said! Look where that took us.

This season is going to present a completely different set of challenges to Cooper. Not that he's not up to job, but let's see him on the job first.

 

[Victoria Swan]

Like others, the jury will be out until the end of August and a) some serious opposition, and b) week in and week out play.

However, I am hugely impressed with how quickly he has the team pressing when out of possession - Dyer against Bristol was like a man possessed on that front. He also seems to have found the key to getting the midfield to contribute goals and has clearly instructed the likes of Fulton, Byers and Grimes to have a go now and then rather than always trying the tika taka around the edge of the box.

Nevertheless we really could do with another striker to supplement (or replace) McBurnie this season - could it be Borja? I hope so.

I am not yet as confident as others that we have solved our set piece fiascos and that is what I'll be watching closely once the season starts because based on last season every team will after us on that front.

Finally I am a bit worried about the man management side. From body language alone I don't see that the players are yet giving him unconditional respect or that he is in their faces motivating them. If you watch at the end of matches he doesn't seem to approach team members with words of encouragement and they don't go near him - he cuts something of an aimless figure wandering the pitch on his own after the ninety minutes. I hope this is just a matter of time (and results) but from Day One Potter seemed to have that man management skill.

 

[Yankee_Jack]

@Victoria Swan .... interesting comment about "unconditional respect". Check out the Liberty training video. I think you'll see Naughton and McB larking about when they have been more focused.

 

[CroJack]

Seeing a bunch of kids every 90 days or so, and winning a youth tournament is not the same as running a club through the rigors of a league season against tough opposition with seasoned managers

It's not, but Cooper has something many other seasoned managers don't - he knows how to play passing and attacking football, he has the know-how. Edie Howe is an excellent example. Since he got Bournemouth promoted to the Premier League many seasoned managers have been outplayed and outsmarted by Howe, and many of them relegated.

... biased officials, inclement weather, injuries, suspensions, interfering executives, asshole agents...

That's something even the best managers can't control. If there is 5 inches of snow on the pitch you can't play slick passing football. Remember Lamah's disallowed goal against WBA that cost Laudrup 8th place in the Premier League?

 

[Victoria Swan]

@Victoria Swan .... interesting comment about "unconditional respect". Check out the Liberty training video. I think you'll see Naughton and McB larking about when they have been more focused.

Yes, I saw that after I wrote the post. That's what I'm talking about.

 

[CroJack]

Finally I am a bit worried about the man management side. From body language alone I don't see that the players are yet giving him unconditional respect or that he is in their faces motivating them. If you watch at the end of matches he doesn't seem to approach team members with words of encouragement and they don't go near him - he cuts something of an aimless figure wandering the pitch on his own after the ninety minutes. I hope this is just a matter of time (and results) but from Day One Potter seemed to have that man management skill.

That's an interesting observation.