The Blobster
Prediction Champ
Recalled by Man united and to be loaned out to Bournemouth
WTF ?
WTF ?
ETHAN LAIRD
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Behindthegoal
Key Player
They’re more like manu style wise.
The Blobster
Prediction Champ
Man U and style don't sit together well .
KVetch
Key Player
Horrible news, there's no one to replace him. We may sign a midfield player and keeper from MK Dons. Not sure that Garrick or Lati can play wing. He was one of the most crucial players we had. We will have to face him next month at home. They loan out 2 players and lose someone like Laird. Fulton seems sure to go as well. Rumours that West Bron want Paterson too. Trying to find a silver lining here. Loans are a good thing but you simply must have a plan B ready. We clearly didn't and were caught out by this news.
We have got to have owners willing to invest in this club.
We have got to have owners willing to invest in this club.
Behindthegoal
Key Player
Garrick has learned a lot, including humility and how to score goals. He played on the wing when he was here.
Apart from any financial considerations United might well look at our respective league postions and deem Bournemouth a better club than us to progress Laird's career. If, in fact this is the case, Russell Martin has to accept responsibility. Never mind, I'm sure he has a top "star" from MK Dons ready to step in and fill the gap. 
CroJack
Key Player
You all know what I say about wing-backs (and wingers) who don't score goals. When you play in an attacking position, providing assists is not enough in modern football. So, get rid of them. And, no, another centre-back (Lati) as a wing-back is not a solution.
I want us to change the formation we play, include more goalscorers in the starting XI, play our centre-backs as centre-backs, improve our pressing game, and finally attack more through the middle by being more direct with the ball. Football is not sex, we don't need a forplay of 55 passes before the penetration.
I want us to change the formation we play, include more goalscorers in the starting XI, play our centre-backs as centre-backs, improve our pressing game, and finally attack more through the middle by being more direct with the ball. Football is not sex, we don't need a forplay of 55 passes before the penetration.
Yankee_Jack
Key Player
We’ve lost Whitaker
Nicely explained
Exactly Ivor, His previous managerial career began and ended at MK Dons. the only players he's had managerial experience with, His level of Championship football experience is doubtful, as would be any Dons players.Apart from any financial considerations United might well look at our respective league postions and deem Bournemouth a better club than us to progress Laird's career. If, in fact this is the case, Russell Martin has to accept responsibility. Never mind, I'm sure he has a top "star" from MK Dons ready to step in and fill the gap.
The fly in the ointment is still the yanks IMO. Seems they are happy to go along with things as they are in this division. Having said that, if money does become available I'd rather see someone more experienced spending it.
I don't think the penny has dropped with Martin yet, that goals not possession win games. Didn't work at MKD and not working here.
Oh for those Laudrup days again.
Yankee_Jack
Key Player
Looks like Martin's method is not working at U-23 either Kristian O'Leary | We could play a different way to get results, but that will not create first-team players | Swansea
If we don't have enough players available for a league fixture (somebody commented that there were only 12 healthy players) then how can we play Soton on Saturday? Did that 12 include Laird, or Whitaker, or Cullen, or Fulton. It seems to me that there's not a lot of logic or pragmatism being employed. I get the notion that Martin is coming in with a new philosophy, but if Martin can't win games with it in the first team, and KOL can't get the U-23 to have much success with it then ... WTF. Something is not right. Either it's the system, the players, or the communication between coaches and players, but football is a simple game .... score more goals than the other team to win games, but score goals. We're having no end of trouble doing that and we ship out two strikers that have barely been given a look while retaining one that's barely been match fit.
If we don't have enough players available for a league fixture (somebody commented that there were only 12 healthy players) then how can we play Soton on Saturday? Did that 12 include Laird, or Whitaker, or Cullen, or Fulton. It seems to me that there's not a lot of logic or pragmatism being employed. I get the notion that Martin is coming in with a new philosophy, but if Martin can't win games with it in the first team, and KOL can't get the U-23 to have much success with it then ... WTF. Something is not right. Either it's the system, the players, or the communication between coaches and players, but football is a simple game .... score more goals than the other team to win games, but score goals. We're having no end of trouble doing that and we ship out two strikers that have barely been given a look while retaining one that's barely been match fit.
As I've said on other threads I'm beginning to have severe doubts about Russell Martin. The man must be the most blinkered I've seen in a long while.
CroJack
Key Player
I can accept that this is a process. I can accept that we don't have quality players who can play possession football without making a lot of defensive errors. I can accept that we don't have Mitrovic up front. I can accept that Martin needs a couple of transfer windows to sign the players he needs.
But there are things that can be fixed right now.
1. Either give Benda a chance or sign a new goalkeeper
2. Fix that high back line we play. We leak too many goals. Switch to 4-3-3, 4-4-2, 4-1-4-1, 4-2-3-1, or any other combo, but we have to play 4 at the back. There are multiple reasons to do that. First of all, two dedicated centre-backs would give us more defensive solidity when it comes to counter-attacks and crosses.
4. We play possession football, a style where we dominate opposition in their own half. But we do that by playing mostly defenders and midfielders, which makes us harmless up front. On the other hand, we commit our defenders so high that they can't defend when they need to. That's the worst possible combo in football - impotent up front, and wide open at the back.
5. If Martin wants to play with a high back line and Naughton as an anchor at the back, then we don't need centre-backs at all. Sell them all, and buy some pacey full-backs who will be able to defend against opposition counter-attacks. And if he still wants to use wing-backs, then he has to buy a couple of goalscoring wingers who can play there. We must have at least five players in the starting XI who can score at least 10 goals per season.
But there are things that can be fixed right now.
1. Either give Benda a chance or sign a new goalkeeper
2. Fix that high back line we play. We leak too many goals. Switch to 4-3-3, 4-4-2, 4-1-4-1, 4-2-3-1, or any other combo, but we have to play 4 at the back. There are multiple reasons to do that. First of all, two dedicated centre-backs would give us more defensive solidity when it comes to counter-attacks and crosses.
This is where they should be when we have the ball
And here is where our centre-backs are when we play 3 at the back under Martin,
and when we have the ball
And here is how we the whole team is positioned when we have the ball
It's obvious why we leak goals. Any ball behind Cabango and Bennet and we are in trouble. Cabango and Bennett are too slow and they simply don't have any chance against opposition's pacey wingers. And when opposition wingers put in a cross who do you think has an advantage in the air? Mitrovic and Moore or Naughton?
3. If you don't have players who can score goals as wing-backs, then don't play formations with wing-backs. Otherwise, you'll have full-backs in wing-backs positions, and centre-backs in full-backs positions. With other words, too many defenders in the starting XI. When you add two defensive midfielders (Grimes and Downes), then you have seven players who normally don't score goals. And when you add Ntcham or Smith, who are both central-midfielders, then you get the picture. Piroe and Paterson have scored 19 out of 26 goals so far. At this rate we will have scored 52-54 goals at the end of the season. Not enough. And here is where our centre-backs are when we play 3 at the back under Martin,
and when we have the ball
And here is how we the whole team is positioned when we have the ball
It's obvious why we leak goals. Any ball behind Cabango and Bennet and we are in trouble. Cabango and Bennett are too slow and they simply don't have any chance against opposition's pacey wingers. And when opposition wingers put in a cross who do you think has an advantage in the air? Mitrovic and Moore or Naughton?
4. We play possession football, a style where we dominate opposition in their own half. But we do that by playing mostly defenders and midfielders, which makes us harmless up front. On the other hand, we commit our defenders so high that they can't defend when they need to. That's the worst possible combo in football - impotent up front, and wide open at the back.
5. If Martin wants to play with a high back line and Naughton as an anchor at the back, then we don't need centre-backs at all. Sell them all, and buy some pacey full-backs who will be able to defend against opposition counter-attacks. And if he still wants to use wing-backs, then he has to buy a couple of goalscoring wingers who can play there. We must have at least five players in the starting XI who can score at least 10 goals per season.
I think your missing Martin's point Crojack. Yes we concede goals. Yes, we don't score many. BUT take a look at our possession figures.
Yankee_Jack
Key Player
Since when do we get green shield stamps for the number of passes we make to go backwards
Behindthegoal
Key Player
You wait till we score that 100 pass goal
I remember a 50+ pass Man City goal from a couple of seasons back being celebrated and fawned over by the pundits to the extent they had an infographic breaking down each pass. 95% of the passes were pointless triangles in City's own third and half, before someone got bored enough with playing keep-away to punt a long ball forward to a breaking team-mate. 2 passes later the ball was in the back of the net. Was this really a 50+ passing goal? No. It was a 3 pass goal, and they might as well have played the decisive pass straight away instead of waiting to make 47 unnecessary passes first. It wasn't even as though those passes pulled the opposition out of shape and created the chance, because the opposition knew they were playing City and so stayed back. The majority of those passes all happened in about the same 15 square yards of the field. It's just masturbation, not football. For my money, possession isn't even in the top 5 most important elements of the game.
CroJack
Key Player
If it was so easy to play decisive passes straight away we would have 31:19 results in football. I'm exaggerating, but I hope you get my point. You have to pass the ball to reach the opposition third and create a chance. And if the opposition don't want to play football and park the bus, then you have to pass the ball around to try to find an opening. And if it takes 50 passes, so be it. It's not Manchester City's fault that Burnley etc. don't want to play football. So if you blame someone for 50 boring passes Manchester City makes, then better blame Burney and the likes. I can assure you that Klopp's Liverpool doesn't allow Manchester City to make 50 boring passes.
Of course, you can ask why play 50 "boring" passes when you can send a long ball towards the opposition goal immediatelly after you regain the possession, just like Big Sam's teams do? And you can ask why should we make several passes, or even 50 of them, when we can send a cross immediatelly after we enter the opposition third? Well, Pep Guardiola wants perfection, and perfection doesn't include chaos. You score in a controlled way, you control what you are doing, and you don't depend on rebounds, deflections etc. Your goals are the result of the attacking actions you have perfected in training. That's why.
Pulling the opposition out of shape is not always the ultimate goal of the passing football. It's something else, and it's psychological. You want to bore the opposition by playing "boring" passes. You want them to believe that it's easy to defend against the passing football, but what you also want to do is to "hypnotise" them, so their movements become robotic and lethargic. They expect that the next and the next pass will be the same, and then boom - you suddenly raise the tempo, make a decisive pass, create a chance, and score. Not many people know Pep has been inspired by Barcelona's excellent handball team. And in handball you do just that - pass the ball around slowly, and then suddenly raise the tempo, make a decisive pass, and shoot. The trick is in a sudden change of tempo.
Well, neither Manchester City nor Swansea play 50 passes before every attacking action. It's actually rare it happens. I am sure Pep and Manchester City would certainly want every opposition team not to park the bus against them, and actually play some footbal, just like Leeds did recently. And have a look what "masturbation, not football" did to Leeds.
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Forget your 50 pass goals and celebrate probably one of the best 5 pass goals ever, that we scored against Man City, finished superbly by Celina into the top right hand corner, each of the 5 passes gaining yards of forward movement, from one goal line to the other in 5 defence splitting passes.
I was sat in the West stand at that end of the pitch so had a close up view of the goal. Brilliant move and we'd played it out of defence.