Huddersfield

Jackflash

Midfield General
Staff member
There's no other way to describe that performance other than diabolical, and the same goes for the manager, who once again never took his hands out of his pockets to show any signs of encouragement to his players, one would think it was us that was winning 4-1, win or lose absolutely no difference that same look, as though he'd just been in a lemon sucking competition. Never once has he taken notes for his half time talk, As I've said before, in training he's being carried by his back room staff, when he's on his own in game time he doesn't seem to understand what's going on. If he was the man that was responsible for the game plan against H/field and they were not implementing it, he'd be tearing his hair out on the sideline. For me he's a fake.
But someone in the club needs to impress upon that team that consistency is the name of the game or they're out. That performance will give a lot of confidence to opposition in coming games. As Ivor pointed out just 3 of 11 deserved any merit.
 

Yankee_Jack

Key Player
@Jackflash ... it seems to me that Tate May have been the catalyst to our better fortunes. He came in the season toward the end of last season, and it appears to have take off from there. Not sure what happened with this “oh shit” game, but at the risk of triggering the wrath of others, Andy Pandy has had more gaps in which to coach recently. There is a correlation between gaps between games and subsequent poor performances

Bennet being sub’d at half time is alarming. Supposedly a leader on the team at the heart of defense, he seems to have switched off for their first goal, but sub’d indicates that all is not well there. That Huddersfield continued to score means that we were not in anyway shutting their players down. We didn’t lack bodies at the crucial moments, they just didn’t make an appearance. A level of disorganization persisted. Other than rank laziness or mental if not physical fatigue, nothing about our performance makes any sense, did we travel well to the match? I don’t think we are an inherently lazy team.

And then there’s the dreaded jinx of the manager of the month award.
 

ivoralljack

Grizzled Veteran
Staff member
I read that Bennet had picked up an injury. As for most of the rest there is no excuse. Bad day at the office? I'm not having that after seeing that debacle of a performance against Forest. We are not playing well of that there is no doubt. Too many players are just going through the motions without contributing anything of note to the game.

Just before Hoory scored his sublime free kick I was about to post that he's in the team for other things as well. Trouble is I'm not seeing too many of those other 'things'. It might be that his game is being affected by those around him who just aren't showing much at all. Lowe. for example, has gone right off the boil. He's not a natural striker so if the ball doesn't run for him he doesn't score. Puts in a sort of a shift but he's been really ineffective of late.

Thing is, with Morris out for maybe the season, we are now virtually bankrupt in terms of strikers. Arriola? Maybe, but he's an unknown quantity and not a dedicated striker anyway. Perhaps we'd better start scouring out of contract players who can fill a gap. Wilf Bony anyone?
 

Yankee_Jack

Key Player
Whitaker is the go to at this point instead of Lowe. Cullen would have been automatic. When Cullen was threatening, Lowe suddenly came alive and started scoring. Following Cullen’s injury, Lowe has been mailing it in. Time for a change. This defeat provides the impetus for a big change.

As for Hourihane, there’s a reason players at Prem clubs become available and welcome a loan out. Sometimes it’s purely that they are on the wrong side of a big squad ... but more often than not there’s some aspect of their game that’s been deemed unacceptable.

Same with Lowe, he doesn’t display the persona of somebody who is hungry.
 

Jackflash

Midfield General
Staff member
@Jackflash ... it seems to me that Tate May have been the catalyst to our better fortunes. He came in the season toward the end of last season, and it appears to have take off from there. Not sure what happened with this “oh shit” game, but at the risk of triggering the wrath of others, Andy Pandy has had more gaps in which to coach recently. There is a correlation between gaps between games and subsequent poor performances

Bennet being sub’d at half time is alarming. Supposedly a leader on the team at the heart of defense, he seems to have switched off for their first goal, but sub’d indicates that all is not well there. That Huddersfield continued to score means that we were not in anyway shutting their players down. We didn’t lack bodies at the crucial moments, they just didn’t make an appearance. A level of disorganization persisted. Other than rank laziness or mental if not physical fatigue, nothing about our performance makes any sense, did we travel well to the match? I don’t think we are an inherently lazy team.

And then there’s the dreaded jinx of the manager of the month award.
With you all the way Yankee on the Tate scenario, Who sits behind Cooper on match day, Tate taking notes, who does Cooper turn his back on the game periodically to talk to, Tate. Who do we see with the squad in training videos, Tate.
 

Yankee_Jack

Key Player
Tate is old school United. Brought up in an environment where nothing but the best ever day in every way got you shit canned.
 

CroJack

Key Player
I can't read other people minds, but judging by the Cooper's post-match interviews he knows what is going on on the pitch during our games. After the Huddersfield game he said "We lacked intensity, our passing should have been quicker and we didn't do the basics right." Spot on.

Apart from the defensive blunder, when we gifted them the first goal (Bidwell, Guehi and Bennett), we played an ok first half. Yes, there were some sloppy passes, but our football was not as bad as the football we played in the first half against Forest. We were actually a better side than Huddersfield in the first half.

Then in the beginning of the second half we conceded two quick goals and the game was over. Their forth was a world class goal.

I really don't think Cooper's shouting from the dugout would have helped. Klopp is known for his antics in the dugout, but now he has lost four matches in a row at Anfield, which last happened a hundred years ago.

I have just watched the replay of the Huddersfield game. We outplayed them in the first 20 minutes and then Bidwell, Guehi and Bennett just switched off. Pitty, because it was obvious that Huddersfield players respected us being one of the top Championship teams. We should have attacked them from the start with everything we had, score a couple of goals, and then controll the game and hit them on counter.

When they scored, they got a boost in confidence, and even hit the post after another defensive blunder from Guehi and Bennett. Then we scored from a free kick and we had a good result at half time.

Early in the second half they scored two quick goals. One was unlucky deflected shot, and another one came from a failed clearance and from a really good Huddersfield play and press. At that point the game was over. Their fourth was a world class goal. Their second and third goals could've been prevented, but when you sit too deep and allow pressure it's what often happens. Luck follows the brave.

The Huddersfield game outcome is the result of Cooper's inability to adress two structural things: one is our passing accuracy, and another one is our pressing.
 

ivoralljack

Grizzled Veteran
Staff member
The Huddersfield game outcome is the result of Cooper's inability to adress two structural things: one is our passing accuracy, and another one is our pressing.
Our passing hence ball retention is complete shit under Cooper never helped by, either the players' inability to create space off the ball to receive passes, or their sheer laziness to make the movements they should. Of course it might be down to fitness issues because pass and move is a 90 minute thing when you have possession. Pressing also requires running and physical effort so, if we're not doing it, we have to ask why.

When I spoke about Bony no doubt you guessed it was tongue in cheek, which it was. However, it sparked a train of thought where I concluded it's not as daft an idea as it might sound. A fit Bony would smash the Championship without a doubt. Even now. He has vast experience and would be an ideal holdup player for Ayew to feed off and also for the other midfielders to run off/past. Apart from scoring, Bony is superb at playing others in and would also offer a big threat at the set-pieces that Hoory could deliver.

If sensible financial terms could be agreed and he's reasonably fit, I would be inclined to give him a whirl. Okay, he wouldn't be the fast flowing, mobile striker that CJ favours but we haven't got one anyway and he could be used to feed the quicker players in. There's not many defenders that could knock Bony off the ball whilst he's waiting for runners to come up in support. Just an out-of-the-box thought for something to tide us over.
 

Jackflash

Midfield General
Staff member
@Jackflash ... it seems to me that Tate May have been the catalyst to our better fortunes. He came in the season toward the end of last season, and it appears to have take off from there. Not sure what happened with this “oh shit” game, but at the risk of triggering the wrath of others, Andy Pandy has had more gaps in which to coach recently. There is a correlation between gaps between games and subsequent poor performances

Bennet being sub’d at half time is alarming. Supposedly a leader on the team at the heart of defense, he seems to have switched off for their first goal, but sub’d indicates that all is not well there. That Huddersfield continued to score means that we were not in anyway shutting their players down. We didn’t lack bodies at the crucial moments, they just didn’t make an appearance. A level of disorganization persisted. Other than rank laziness or mental if not physical fatigue, nothing about our performance makes any sense, did we travel well to the match? I don’t think we are an inherently lazy team.

And then there’s the dreaded jinx of the manager of the month award.
I can't read other people minds, but judging by the Cooper's post-match interviews he knows what is going on on the pitch during our games. After the Huddersfield game he said "We lacked intensity, our passing should have been quicker and we didn't do the basics right." Spot on.

Apart from the defensive blunder, when we gifted them the first goal (Bidwell, Guehi and Bennett), we played an ok first half. Yes, there were some sloppy passes, but our football was not as bad as the football we played in the first half against Forest. We were actually a better side than Huddersfield in the first half.

Then in the beginning of the second half we conceded two quick goals and the game was over. Their forth was a world class goal.

I really don't think Cooper's shouting from the dugout would have helped. Klopp is known for his antics in the dugout, but now he has lost four matches in a row at Anfield, which last happened a hundred years ago.

I have just watched the replay of the Huddersfield game. We outplayed them in the first 20 minutes and then Bidwell, Guehi and Bennett just switched off. Pitty, because it was obvious that Huddersfield players respected us being one of the top Championship teams. We should have attacked them from the start with everything we had, score a couple of goals, and then controll the game and hit them on counter.

When they scored, they got a boost in confidence, and even hit the post after another defensive blunder from Guehi and Bennett. Then we scored from a free kick and we had a good result at half time.

Early in the second half they scored two quick goals. One was unlucky deflected shot, and another one came from a failed clearance and from a really good Huddersfield play and press. At that point the game was over. Their fourth was a world class goal. Their second and third goals could've been prevented, but when you sit too deep and allow pressure it's what often happens. Luck follows the brave.

The Huddersfield game outcome is the result of Cooper's inability to adress two structural things: one is our passing accuracy, and another one is our pressing.
I'm not saying Cooper should be shouting from the dugout, but for instance if there's a opposition throw in on his touchline, with all players facing him, you see other managers pointing out players that need marking, as he is in a better position than most to see that, but no still hands in pockets. I wouldn't say we outplayed them in the first 20, I'd rather think we contained them. to me our best play was the final 15 of the first half.
 

Yankee_Jack

Key Player
@ivoralljack ... Bony .... why not ... if he's in reasonable shape. He could occupy 2 defenders just standing in place. His defensive strengths alone on corners would be a big addition. He would relish long throw-ins into the box from Roberts and Bidwell never mind the crosses. He's a leader on and off the field, and we need some dogged experience in the squad to keep the young kids in-line and focused.

@CroJack ... I admire your dedication watching that game again, and I agree we were not that bad, but just not good enough when it mattered. Did we really create that much in the final third before Morris's injury though.

Bony's last club was Al-Ittihad, wherever that is, but his boys were part of our academy and I was always given to understand that his family enjoyed living in Swansea.
 

Jackflash

Midfield General
Staff member
I can't read other people minds, but judging by the Cooper's post-match interviews he knows what is going on on the pitch during our games. After the Huddersfield game he said "We lacked intensity, our passing should have been quicker and we didn't do the basics right." Spot on.

Apart from the defensive blunder, when we gifted them the first goal (Bidwell, Guehi and Bennett), we played an ok first half. Yes, there were some sloppy passes, but our football was not as bad as the football we played in the first half against Forest. We were actually a better side than Huddersfield in the first half.

Then in the beginning of the second half we conceded two quick goals and the game was over. Their forth was a world class goal.

I really don't think Cooper's shouting from the dugout would have helped. Klopp is known for his antics in the dugout, but now he has lost four matches in a row at Anfield, which last happened a hundred years ago.

I have just watched the replay of the Huddersfield game. We outplayed them in the first 20 minutes and then Bidwell, Guehi and Bennett just switched off. Pitty, because it was obvious that Huddersfield players respected us being one of the top Championship teams. We should have attacked them from the start with everything we had, score a couple of goals, and then controll the game and hit them on counter.

When they scored, they got a boost in confidence, and even hit the post after another defensive blunder from Guehi and Bennett. Then we scored from a free kick and we had a good result at half time.

Early in the second half they scored two quick goals. One was unlucky deflected shot, and another one came from a failed clearance and from a really good Huddersfield play and press. At that point the game was over. Their fourth was a world class goal. Their second and third goals could've been prevented, but when you sit too deep and allow pressure it's what often happens. Luck follows the brave.

The Huddersfield game outcome is the result of Cooper's inability to adress two structural things: one is our passing accuracy, and another one is our pressing.
" judging by Coopers post match interviews he knows what's going on on the pitch during our games. After the Huddersfield game he said we lacked intensity, our passing should have been quicker, and we didn't do the basics right"
A verdict 20,000 supporters would have come to had they been in attendance. If those are his views after the game, why the f#ck didn't he do something about it during the game. As I've said, we may just as well have a cardboard cutout of him planted on the sideline and give him the day off.[/QUOTE]
 

Jackflash

Midfield General
Staff member
I'm not saying he should be shouting from the dugout, but occasions like when there's a opposition throw in from his sideline, he has a better view as to who needs marking as all players are facing him, but no never once does he point something like that out, as other managers do. to compare his reading of the game to Klopp is a bit OTT.
 

ivoralljack

Grizzled Veteran
Staff member
@ivoralljack Where is Bony now? A short term contract and reasonable wages would be great.
As far as I know he's out of contract and been training with Newport County with his pal the manager Michael Flynn. Asked in a BBC interview if he'd like to play for the Swans again, the answer was a resounding yes! He said he loves the club and he and his family love the city which they regard as home. He's good pals with Andre Ayew, which helps and, if we signed him, I'm sure he'd give his all for us.

I think he's 32 now but I doubt he's lost any pace as he never had much to begin with. His game was built on brute strength (always an asset in the Championship) and he won't have lost any of that. It all depends on how fit he can become. If we could strike a deal on a game by game basis with big bonuses for goal involvement, it could be a mutually viable option. Throw in the promise of a contract (even if for just one year) if he does well and we might be in business.

As @Yankee_Jack pointed out, his aerial strength would be more than useful in defence as well as attack and not many opponents would attempt to bully us with him around!! I'm sure he'd get himself fit, so any possible deal would depend on the financials.
 

CroJack

Key Player
to compare his reading of the game to Klopp is a bit OTT.
I don't understand your sarcasm. I didn't compare Cooper's reading of the game to Klopp's. Where did you get that from? The point I was trying to make is that shouting from the dugout is not so effective as you might think. Actually, it can be counter-productive. First of all, it shows you don't trust your players, and second, you can make them nervous and more prone to make mistakes.

And if shouting form the dugout was so effective, then the managers who shout more would be the most successful managers in the world.

Defensive blunders happen so quickly that a manager doesn't have time to react. Just have a look at the first goal we conceded against Huddersfield.
And what can a manager do when a player make a sloppy pass? Shout "Don't make sloppy passes!"? C'mon.

So, no, we didn't lose Huddersfield game because Cooper was just watching in the dugout with his hands in his pockets. We lost it because: a) our players were not performing up to the standards required for this league, b) we were sloppy in possession, c) we made defensive mistakes we don't usually do, d) we didn't create much up front, and e) our pressing game was poor - we didn't press as a team.

While you are criticising Cooper for being passive in the dugout, I am criticising him for more important things: wrong formations, wrong line-ups, too defensive setup, poor passing accuracy as a result of our style of play, too much hoofing, and lack of proper pressing.
 

Yankee_Jack

Key Player
Shouting from the dug out ....

Laudrup did none of that and was by far the best manager / head coach we have ever had, BUT, was criticized loudly on the forums for being that way. Laudrup did his job quietly, adroitly, never missed a trick on the field, with clever match management and sub utilization, and was the best player on the grass in training. Put a target on his back by playing Ki at CB instead of Monk in the league cup final ... my favorite decision of all time.

Monk on the other hand ... everybody's hero (except for the savvy Swanselonas) ... was a t**t on the touch line and largely ineffective.

Cooper ... looks like Andy Pandy the puppet on strings ... pretty much manages that way. Could never be confused with Laudrup on the practice field. Adroit is a word never to be used in the same sentence as Andy Pandy ... unless you're talking about the puppet in the kid's tv show, who aced it.
 

Jackflash

Midfield General
Staff member
@Jackflash ... it seems to me that Tate May have been the catalyst to our better fortunes. He came in the season toward the end of last season, and it appears to have take off from there. Not sure what happened with this “oh shit” game, but at the risk of triggering the wrath of others, Andy Pandy has had more gaps in which to coach recently. There is a correlation between gaps between games and subsequent poor performances

Bennet being sub’d at half time is alarming. Supposedly a leader on the team at the heart of defense, he seems to have switched off for their first goal, but sub’d indicates that all is not well there. That Huddersfield continued to score means that we were not in anyway shutting their players down. We didn’t lack bodies at the crucial moments, they just didn’t make an appearance. A level of disorganization persisted. Other than rank laziness or mental if not physical fatigue, nothing about our performance makes any sense, did we travel well to the match? I don’t think we are an inherently lazy team.

And then there’s the dreaded jinx of the manager of the month award.
With you all the way Yankee on the Tate
I don't understand your sarcasm. I didn't compare Cooper's reading of the game to Klopp's. Where did you get that from? The point I was trying to make is that shouting from the dugout is not so effective as you might think. Actually, it can be counter-productive. First of all, it shows you don't trust your players, and second, you can make them nervous and more prone to make mistakes.

And if shouting form the dugout was so effective, then the managers who shout more would be the most successful managers in the world.

Defensive blunders happen so quickly that a manager doesn't have time to react. Just have a look at the first goal we conceded against Huddersfield.
And what can a manager do when a player make a sloppy pass? Shout "Don't make sloppy passes!"? C'mon.

So, no, we didn't lose Huddersfield game because Cooper was just watching in the dugout with his hands in his pockets. We lost it because: a) our players were not performing up to the standards required for this league, b) we were sloppy in possession, c) we made defensive mistakes we don't usually do, d) we didn't create much up front, and e) our pressing game was poor - we didn't press as a team.

While you are criticising Cooper for being passive in the dugout, I am criticising him for more important things: wrong formations, wrong line-ups, too defensive setup, poor passing accuracy as a result of our style of play, too much hoofing, and lack of proper pressing.
Sorry CJ there was certainly no intention to be sarcastic, actually it was you that brought Klopp into it, with his touchline shouting, and i was just commenting that there is no comparison to them as managers, If the game is going against you surely the answer iisn't to stand and watch it happen with your hands in your pockets, the reaction of any normal manager is to attempt to motivate your players, and that's the difference I was pointing out between Cooper and Klopp, once again sorry if you took it the wrong way. Certainly not intended.
 

Jackflash

Midfield General
Staff member
Shouting from the dug out ....

Laudrup did none of that and was by far the best manager / head coach we have ever had, BUT, was criticized loudly on the forums for being that way. Laudrup did his job quietly, adroitly, never missed a trick on the field, with clever match management and sub utilization, and was the best player on the grass in training. Put a target on his back by playing Ki at CB instead of Monk in the league cup final ... my favorite decision of all time.

Monk on the other hand ... everybody's hero (except for the savvy Swanselonas) ... was a t**t on the touch line and largely ineffective.

Cooper ... looks like Andy Pandy the puppet on strings ... pretty much manages that way. Could never be confused with Laudrup on the practice field. Adroit is a word never to be used in the same sentence as Andy Pandy ... unless you're talking about the puppet in the kid's tv show, who aced it.
Don't think there was any need for any shouting from Laudrup Yannkee,, he had them finely tuned on the training ground, as Routlidge once pointed out ," He doesn't tell you what to do, he shows you". You couldn't even begin to imagine Cooper in that role.
 

KVetch

Key Player
Gutted to hear about Morris but I expected it after seeing him go down. Is there any hope for Cullen or Routs coming back this season? I don't think we're signing Bony, Whittaker is going to have to step up. I'm not ready to panic yet. I don't like trotting out the same lineup for a midweek and Saturday match. At least he's using substitutes
 
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