Swans v Notts Forest

CroJack

Key Player
If you can’t win make sure you don’t lose. Poor pass back by Byers in the Forest half to Grimes, ball intercepted by Grabban who races downfield . Grimes chases but for reasons unknown fails to make the tackle, defence all upfield and in disarray, Semedo slots home unmarked.
I'm not even sure that Byers pass was so poor that Grimes couldn't recieve it.

Grimes didn't get a yellow card during the match, so either a clean tackle or a professional foul was an obvious option. I don't understand why he didn't do that.

As for Semedo being totally unmarked is criminal, which just shows that we have not erradicated last seasons mistakes when lack of positional awareness and lack of anticipation have cost us too many soft goals.
 

ivoralljack

Grizzled Veteran
Staff member
Interesting to note that Matt Grimes admitted this morning that he should have 'taken one for the team' and committed a professional foul. It was naive of him not to and for the life of me I cannot understand why a player of his experience didn't do so. :unsure: It was an expensive lesson and probably cost us a point whilst allowing Forest another two in their own quest for promotion.

There's no doubt that we need to harden up as a team and become more professional in our attitude. There's a lot of talent in our squad and, despite the disappointment against Forest, I do believe we have enough about us to mount a serious challenge this season. We just need to cut out the more stupid mistakes. That said, we might struggle to get anything from an in-form Bristol City but I'll accept that so long as the lads give the game all they've got. And I mean ALL.
 

Behindthegoal

Key Player
Bidwell's passing stats don't reveal everything. It seemed to me that given a choice between Grimes and Rodon, he always passed to Rodon.
 

The Blobster

Prediction Champ
Usually passing behind his target ( rather than in front of them so we couldn't progress forward at pace ) , he single handedly slowed our transitions with sloppy passes , his pass stats might be good but the majority of those passes were absolutely shocking and well below an acceptable level. . This is a case where the stats do not give a true picture !
 

CroJack

Key Player
1. Bidwell's passing stats don't reveal everything. 2. It seemed to me that given a choice between Grimes and Rodon, he always passed to Rodon.
1. Agree that passing ststs don't reveal everything but what they reveal is accurate passing.
2. I have to watch the replay to give you the answer to this one. What I want to see is whether he had better options or not. Forest parked the bus and were very agressive by tight marking all our advanced players. Was Grimes availivable to recieve Bidwell's passes? I have to watch the replay.

Usually passing behind his target ( rather than in front of them so we couldn't progress forward at pace ) , he single handedly slowed our transitions with sloppy passes , his
There is no point in passing in front of the target or to the target when the target is man-marked and under pressure. We did it a lot of times and lost the ball.

The problem was that we were too static, the players didn't move into the spaces to recieve the ball. We had passes but we didn't have moves to play pass & move football. And it was not only Bidwell, the whole team passed the ball backwards. They were simply forced to do that by Forest defensive tactics.

It's obvious that the Swans have two problems now. The first one is we don't know how to play against teams who press us high, and the second one is we don't know how to break down teams who park the bus and refuse to play some football.

So, what to do when opposition park the bus?
  1. Produce pieces of individual magic (dribbles, triangles in tight spaces and through balls)
  2. Bomb them with crosses, create panic and take advantage
  3. Shoot from outside of box
  4. Exploit set pieces (free-kicks and corner-kicks
That's exactly what Manchester City and Liverpool do, and they are experts in breaking down teams who park the bus. Manchester City use creativity more then Liverpool, and Liverpool use more crosses and set pieces. Last season Liverpool scored by far most set pieces goals and goals from crosses in the Premier League. Their full-backs had something like 12+ assists each last season.

Let's go back to the Swans v Forest game. First we have to agree that Forest parked the bus.

Here is Swans and Forest average players position:

IMG_20190916_165028.jpg

Now let's look at our starting XI:

IMG_20190916_170017.jpg
1. What I see here is lack of creativity. With all respect to Borja, he is not Oli. Oli is more mobile and creative. Ayew has skills but he is not using them to take on defenders. Not creative enough. Routs and Celina are the only ones who can produce a piece of magic. Grimes play too deep, and Fulton doesn't have creativity at all. So, out of 6 players who are supposed to create something we had only two able to do that. That's not enough. Byers and Garrick should have been in our starting XI.

2. Crosses. Our cross accuracy against Forest was terrible, and we didn't put in enough crosses into the Forest box. Another thing is that we didn't have enough bodies in the Forest box when we put in crosses. We have to risk more in these situations.

3. Shots from outside of box. We have four players who can score from outside of box. Celina, Byers, Fulton and Naughton. Celina had a day off against Forest, Fulton doesn't shoot enough (I don't know why), Byers and Naughton were not in the starting XI.

4. Set pieces. I think we have scored one goal directly from free-kicks since Gylfi left. Grimes is trying but he can't even hit the target. Delivery from free-kicks and corner-kicks was awful against Forest.

Conclusion

We didn't have enough creative players on the pitch against Forest, we didn't put in many crosses into the Forest box, we didn't have enough bodies up front, we didn't shoot from outside of box and we were awful at set-pieces. No wonder we couldn't score and win the game.



 

KVetch

Key Player
1. Agree that passing ststs don't reveal everything but what they reveal is accurate passing.
2. I have to watch the replay to give you the answer to this one. What I want to see is whether he had better options or not. Forest parked the bus and were very agressive by tight marking all our advanced players. Was Grimes availivable to recieve Bidwell's passes? I have to watch the replay.



There is no point in passing in front of the target or to the target when the target is man-marked and under pressure. We did it a lot of times and lost the ball.

The problem was that we were too static, the players didn't move into the spaces to recieve the ball. We had passes but we didn't have moves to play pass & move football. And it was not only Bidwell, the whole team passed the ball backwards. They were simply forced to do that by Forest defensive tactics.

It's obvious that the Swans have two problems now. The first one is we don't know how to play against teams who press us high, and the second one is we don't know how to break down teams who park the bus and refuse to play some football.

So, what to do when opposition park the bus?
  1. Produce pieces of individual magic (dribbles, triangles in tight spaces and through balls)
  2. Bomb them with crosses, create panic and take advantage
  3. Shoot from outside of box
  4. Exploit set pieces (free-kicks and corner-kicks
That's exactly what Manchester City and Liverpool do, and they are experts in breaking down teams who park the bus. Manchester City use creativity more then Liverpool, and Liverpool use more crosses and set pieces. Last season Liverpool scored by far most set pieces goals and goals from crosses in the Premier League. Their full-backs had something like 12+ assists each last season.

Let's go back to the Swans v Forest game. First we have to agree that Forest parked the bus.

Here is Swans and Forest average players position:

1. What I see here is lack of creativity. With all respect to Borja, he is not Oli. Oli is more mobile and creative. Ayew has skills but he is not using them to take on defenders. Not creative enough. Routs and Celina are the only ones who can produce a piece of magic. Grimes play too deep, and Fulton doesn't have creativity at all. So, out of 6 players who are supposed to create something we had only two able to do that. That's not enough. Byers and Garrick should have been in our starting XI.

2. Crosses. Our cross accuracy against Forest was terrible, and we didn't put in enough crosses into the Forest box. Another thing is that we didn't have enough bodies in the Forest box when we put in crosses. We have to risk more in these situations.

3. Shots from outside of box. We have four players who can score from outside of box. Celina, Byers, Fulton and Naughton. Celina had a day off against Forest

Conclusion

We didn't have enough creative players on the pitch against Forest, we didn't put in many crosses into the Forest box, we didn't have enough bodies up front, we didn't shoot from outside of box and we were awful at set-pieces. No wonder we couldn't score and win
You're right on the money there. There was a few games last season where Dan James was the only one able to break down the opposing teams. With his pace he made them make mistakes so the Swans could score. Need that again, and it probably won't come from set pieces.
 

ivoralljack

Grizzled Veteran
Staff member
You're right on the money there. There was a few games last season where Dan James was the only one able to break down the opposing teams. With his pace he made them make mistakes so the Swans could score. Need that again, and it probably won't come from set pieces.
Pace is vital in breaking down defences. If the team as a whole plays fast, attacking fluent football, all well and good. In its absence you have to look to individuals to do it. Garrick is the nearest we've got to James but perhaps it's too early in his development to sling him straight in on a regular basis. However, I do feel that we should be using him more than we have been if only to give him more exposure to this level with some cameo appearances.
 

CroJack

Key Player
Don't get me wrong guys. Bidwell is not a world beater, he lacks pace, and I agree that his passing should be better. But what I like about him is his defending and his crosses. In some of the games we have played this season he has blocked all crosses coming from his side (in the same games Roberts let all, or almost all, crosses come into our box from his side), his man-marking is excellent, he is not back-peddaling like Taylor and Olsson used to do, his crosses are mostly accurate, he knows when to tackle to break opposition counter-attacks, and he is clever positionally. If he had pace and some dribbling skills, and if he passed the ball better than he does he would be an excellent full-back. I agree with both @Behindthegoal and @The Blobster that Naughton and John would be better options when going forward, but defensively he is our best left-back right now in my opinion.
 

Ladygargar

Fox in the Box
Staff member
Well; that was the worst performance so far; the result says it all - NF were gutsy but not particularly good, the Ref was shocking the linesmen visually impaired and the swans - well they just weren’t on it at all - I’m hoping it gives them a good boot up the arse - and its partly due to the international break.......Such a Shame tho because the Jacks were SUPERB!!!
 

KVetch

Key Player
Pace is vital in breaking down defences. If the team as a whole plays fast, attacking fluent football, all well and good. In its absence you have to look to individuals to do it. Garrick is the nearest we've got to James but perhaps it's too early in his development to sling him straight in on a regular basis. However, I do feel that we should be using him more than we have been if only to give him more exposure to this level with some cameo appearances.
Dyer still has it when he comes back on a regular basis. If Ayew doesn't have to play too much defense he can create. I always liked Montero too. Would be a shame to waste this good start. Bristol will be a good match.
 
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