Swans v Brentford

Yankee_Jack

Key Player
When I look at Cooper, I get this urge to tap on his forehead and ask if anyone is home.

He was successful with kids. Clearly, kids are not senior pros, and Unders tournaments are not professional senior leagues. I made this point when he was hired. I was not happy with his hiring. But @Jackflash may have hit the nail on the head - he benefited from Potter’s polish. Cooper has never played at this level (neither had Rogers), but Rogers had a game plan, the blarney, and has delivered time and again at different clubs since us. Cooper is not Rogers and looks like he’s going to keep BoBo company. If Cooper was the best of the pack that interviewed for the job, then wtf were the others ... or was Cooper the cheapest that could breath standing up and we are getting exactly what we bought.
 

ivoralljack

Grizzled Veteran
Staff member
Okay, let's get things straight from the off - I am NOT calling for Cooper's head. It's fair that he should be given time to look at his mistakes, and he will need time because there have been so many of them, and put them right but, should our recent dire form continue unabated, I think it's also fair to put forward the possibility that the hierarchy will be considering his position. It's not too late for us to regroup for a realistic tilt at promotion but Cooper has to show that he's the man to do it. Thus far, I have grave doubts because I have difficulty in remembering when our performances, particularly those of late, have been quite so abysmally and consistently awful.

Personally I hope he CAN fix it - he's young, likeable, Welsh and I had a nodding acquaintance with his Dad at one point in time. But for the sake of argument, let's assume the worst: that the club will come to feel an experienced replacement is required, who do you posters feel would be the man to take us on and get the best out of which is a talented squad? I haven't thought things through as this was a spur of the moment thing, so I have no immediate suggestion but I will make one when I've collected my thoughts. Perhaps you guys can do the same.
 

Yankee_Jack

Key Player
@ivoralljack ... one of the gravest errors a company can make is to continue with a boss under the hope that the person can stop digging the hole and climb out of it. Hope is not a strategy; it is the last resort of those without a strategy. We should have a contingency plan, It used to be insert Curt, hire yet another, replace Curt. This time we should insert Curt, have him aided by Leon and Toshack, and let him run with it ... could he do any worse, I think not .... and then figure out where we are end of season.

As I have pointed out previously (I think in the Barnsley autopsy), something happened during the September international break. Where we are now in terms of output is not the result of a slow trend down, but a dramatic shift down with a sequence of results and performances that have persisted at a very low level and creeping downward still. Our collective high from August prevented us from recognizing immediately what had happened and only now is the hangover setting in.

If there's one thing Cooper has plenty of is data and information, perhaps too much for him to cogently process, but you only need a superficial glance at the numbers to understand what has happened. Cooper, if there are any brain cells functioning behind that blank expression, has to realize that something has shifted, and he has to be the one to be savvy enough recognize what it is, savvy enough to know how to revert back, and the one to remedy it. I'm not hopeful. I'm not hopeful that he has the ability to step back and objectively asses the situation, that willing to recognize an oh-shit, that savvy to fix it. If you're going to avoid the iceberg hit the brakes or turn the rudder, but do it. Does he even see the iceberg or know where the rudder is.

@Jackflash in the Brentford thread posted something along the lines of Potter's legacy was enjoyed until the end of August then Cooper in a fit of hubris discarded it and went off on his own .... and here we are. One of the hallmarks of the series of coaches Martinez, Sousa, Rogers, Laudrup was that they embraced and embellished what they inherited and we benefited by the continuity and the evolution. Monk broke that and every coach thereafter, with the exception of Curt, tried their own thing and failed miserably because they didn't have the chops. The one exception being Potter who like a skillful Jedi master started a new school. Was what Potter did too sophisticated for Cooper? Is it a case of through practice after practice Cooper just washed the dye right out of the cloth, or was it a more abrupt shift in theory and practice, and the players have just not bought into it or have but technically, tactically its all falling short. Players would run through stone walls for Potter, Roberts often did, but I don't think one of them are motivated to do a fraction of that for Cooper.

Where do we go from here? I don't think we can wait. We waited on Monk ... gave him enough rope to hang himself thrice over. We waited on Clement ... and he had Portuguese starlets passing into the advertising boards. We waited on BoBo ... he tried to teach Leon how to pass (WTF he really did). How much rope can we spare Cooper. What's his pay off? Can we afford it - everybody is crying poverty? Will we make a decision driven by cash or performance? If performance, then if the Shit Streak continues against Cardiff, he's hung himself - he will have demonstrated no leadership, no ability to recognize Club culture and history, no ability to select and motivate a team worthy of our shirt. If cash, then Cooper remains at the helm, the iceberg looms, and the season is done!

The unknown factor ... Birch ... is he his own man with a good sense of when enough is enough, or is he an owner's toady.
 
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CroJack

Key Player
Some perspective is needed.

Last season under Graham Potter we had three poor spells with bad results.

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We are still only 2 points off the second place.

Yes, the results have not been good, but why would we blame Cooper for sloppy passing and poor finishing? Against Barnsley we missed 4 big chances, and we created chances against Brentford.

Here is xG (expected goals) for Swans v Brentford game.

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Two of the Brentford goals are goals you don't score in every game. A beautiful curling shot and a shot from 25 yards. Fair enough. We had some shots from the same positions and didn't hit the target. The third goal is a bit unlucky own goal.

I'm actually more optimistic now when we do create many chances than I was before. Yes, the results have been crap lately, but sloppy passing and lack of concentration can be adressed and corrected.
 

Yankee_Jack

Key Player
....

I'm actually more optimistic now when we do create many chances than I was before. Yes, the results have been crap lately, but sloppy passing and lack of concentration can be adressed and corrected.
But it's not being corrected, it is persisting, it is getting worse. This is why the results have been crap -- not lately as in just recently but for the past several weeks. Members commented in August when the results were bordering on the historic, that intra-game performance was lacking in key aspects; the lack has matured into a rot.

Potter had his streaks of poor results but we never suffered like this; we never performed like this, or rather the return on our effort was never this shambolic. If anything, some of our streaks were exacerbated by Potter trying to be too clever and asking too much of the players, but at least he was being clever and he was humble enough to speak intelligently about what had happened. We have performed miserably at home since the infamous break (1 point out of 12). We have performed marginally better away from home (4 points out of 9). Cooper just grumbles that he is not happy and that it's not good enough ... no shit!

As @ivoralljack as pointed out, we are at a juncture, the Cardiff match must either pivot us back upwards, or pivot Cooper into a tightly time limited performance evaluation. Birch is the unknown factor. Does he have a track record to indicate when he pulls the trigger? Is he ruthless and his own man with a keen sense of when enough is enough or an owner's toady. Are we going to be cash or performance driven in the decision. What is Cooper's buy out?
 

ivoralljack

Grizzled Veteran
Staff member
I get what you say, CJ, but I also understand Yankee's points as well. Somewhere between the two lies the truth I suppose. Thing is, whilst as you correctly state we are only 2 points off second place, it's not just the results which have been poor (some against lowly teams) it's the WAY we have been playing that's so alarming. Our ball retention has become almost non-existent along with those delicious passing triangles that once typified our game - and what passing we do try is unacceptably bad. It's been described as sloppy but I see it as downright atrocious to the extent that I wonder how professional footballers can plumb to such abysmal depths. It really is that bad!!

The ball and what you do with it is God on the football field. Possession is precious because without it the other team can't hurt you and if you lose possession you should sweat blood to get it back. Having played the game with very decent players, of course I understand that possession for possession's sake doesn't cut it and it's what you do with possession that really counts. And that's what I'm NOT seeing. We are wasteful, lethargic, slipshod and playing like a team of strangers who don't know what the fcuk to do with the ball when they've got it.

To my mind, any manager worth his salt should regard that as totally unacceptable and put things right in training. Given the way we've been playing of late where we seem to be in remorseless decline in terms of performance, I have to ask the question if the players respect the manager. At the kindest they look as if they haven't got a clue what he wants even if they do respect him. Mr Birch needs to be keeping a close eye.
 

KVetch

Key Player
The footwork needs to get better. The last few matches the opponents just take the ball away. The effort to get around them is largely gone. Peterson did, Bidwell and Ayew have their moments but what happened. It wasn't this bad early on. Been waiting a long time for Sunday.
 

Jackflash

Midfield General
Staff member
The footwork needs to get better. The last few matches the opponents just take the ball away. The effort to get around them is largely gone. Peterson did, Bidwell and Ayew have their moments but what happened. It wasn't this bad early on. Been waiting a long time for Sunday.
Yes I agree, 2 points , Getting robbed of the ball, and needless bad distribution, both one as bad of the other. This is where Leon's experience would be invauable.when we are in possesion we seem to worry too much about losing the ball rather than being attack minded.we have been here before, playing it square in our own half and losng possession.As Yankee says, put some experenced wide men to open the game up, surely Routs must be penned in for this coming game.
As Yankee questions, where does Birch stand in all this? Is he an American yes man,or the chairman that he'd like us to think he is, if so then he needs to start practicing what he preaches.I think we must now accept Cooper shot Curt and Leon a convincing line regarding his views on taking the club forward, views that would probably work with kids, but now he's up against managers who can and will outthink him for a passtime.There's one word that's very relivant in a division the one league from the Premiership.Experience.
 
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