Boom to Bust?

[Jackflash]

Can't see the stadiums full again until a proven vaccine is available in the scale of millions, Even after lockdown health officials say this virus will still be contagious. No vaccine on the horizon at the moment, even when one is produced there will be a reasonably long trial proving period, until then I think there's a long way to go yet.

 

[CroJack]

Can't see the stadiums full again until a proven vaccine is available in the scale of millions

We need a medicine that can supress the severe symptoms so people don't develop acute respiratory distress syndrom. There are already many trials going on in the hospitals around the world, some of them very promising.

It's estimated that more than 90% Covid-19 infected have mild, cold-like symptoms. Some virologists say that the actual number of infected is up to 80 times higher than the number of confirmed cases. If that's true, then we are much closer to herd immunity than we think we are.

Last week German top virologists visited more than hundred families infected with Covid-19. They wanted to see the concentration of the Covid-19 viruses on the surfaces in the houses and flats. They were surprised that they couldn't find any active viruses on the door handles, toilets, kitchen tables, floors...They found dead viruses, but not any active. Absolutely nowhere. They concluded that the main way of transmission is coughing and breathing. If this is true, then any masks worn in public places gives you an excellent protection. In closed spaces you are in trouble because of the high concentration of the virus in the air.

All virologists agree: the more you are exposed to the virus, the more sick you get.
Which means you are more in danger in a supermarket than inside a stadium under the open air.

 

[CroJack]

This is a round-up of the state of "play" around the domestic leagues: 'Clubs at every level are at risk' - the financial nightmare facing football

 

[CroJack]

 

[ivoralljack]

The lunatics are still at large then giving it large.

 

[CroJack]

The lunatics are still at large then giving it large.

£61 m for the Swedish "starlet" Alexander Isak
£135 m for Saul Niguez and £85.000 a week more than he earns now.

 

[ivoralljack]

There's no halfway house between me and former Palace owner, Simon Jordan - sometimes I think he talks utter bollocks: other times I think he makes enormous sense. However, his article in yesterday's Sun is one I'm in total agreement with. Here's an abridged version but the whole article is worth a read.

END PAY LUNACY: Clubs must seize back control from players and agents.

The Premier League has its greatest opportunity sine the 1992 Sky 'revolution' to rid a plague on its own house. And that is the disproportionate power and financial influence of players, agents and the union over the game.

Premier League clubs have now a clear vision of what happens if, say, a broadcaster took their money away. They have seen what happens when the finances disappear and, if that doesn't bring about changes, then they deserve all they get. The only thing that clubs can do to change the conditions surrounding the loss of all income is to reduce their biggest cost - player wages. Do that and they have got their answer.

Frankly, we're seeing football's backside right now - the embarrassment of begging players for help. Tragically clubs have paid players 'fuck off' money and they have repaid it by effectively telling the clubs to 'fuck off' in their hour of need. Players - who benefitted incredibly alongside managers and agents, from their clubs' abilities to negotiate huge money from broadcasters - were given 80% of it and most of them couldn't really care less about their own industry.

The PFA - funded by Premier League money obtained by threatening strike action - are now kicking up dust (Gordon Taylor) about players being 'put in corners' demanding that the clubs show accounts when even Blind Pew could see the revenue losses....... Football cannot ever allow itself to go cap in hand to the players. CHANGE MUST NOW COME AND IN A HURRY. [My caps] The industry needs to clean up its act. Here's my 5 point proposal.

1 Salary caps across leagues linked to turnover...........

2 The transfer market guide - a net allowance of 20% of the previous year's turnover on transfer spend.

3 The transfer window to be abolished specifically because of racheted-up January prices.......

4 Agents should only be able to act for one party - clubs or players. They should be reduced to 5% commission, and levies of between 3 to 5% on that commission to put another £15 million back into the football pyramid.

5 The PFA should be stripped of its £27 million-a-year GIFT from the Premier League after their divisive and destructive behaviour in this crisis. Instead it should be given to grassroots football.......

All this might be wishful thinking but it shouldn't be. It would give sanity and financial stability to the football industry. Alternatively, given what we've seen with the players, let's just allow the lunatics to continue to run the asylum.

Jordan makes a lot of sense and I'd love to see him as the football 'supremo' in this country. Common sense and fairness would reign for a change.

By the way, I wonder what our owners are making of this? I think they are seeing their investment about to come crashing down on their heads. What a shame!! I feel so sorry for them. I wonder if they are thinking about cutting their losses and doing a runner?

 

[Yankee_Jack]

Clubs have had the power all along. They've chosen not to exercise it. A club has always been able to set the amount that they are willing to pay a player and his agent. There has never been a gun to their head. Likewise, the player has been to demand what they want and then choose to accept the offer ... or not. There's never been a gun to their head. And, with respect to agents, it is the clubs that accept the situation of paying the player's agent instead of the player. The clubs did not have to do that.

What has happened is that clubs, in a frantic effort to stay "competitive" (and I quote that term deliberately) have chased their "dream" like a drunken sailor chasing a hooker. If clubs had agreed among themselves to set a line and a limit, then they would have been in collusion and in violation of anti-trust. What was required was for executive management independently to prudently manage to budget and for owners to recognize, accept and operate within the inherent risk of the industry and its competitive structures. Financial Fair Play was a anaemic attempt to enforce that sort of management and operation. An attempt without vigilance, transparency, compliance and frankly the balls to enforce even the principal of it.

Now let's talk about the concept of "competitive". We all saw our FA Cup tie against City under Potter. We all saw one of the top team's in Europe kept at bay for the best part of 90 minutes, fall 2-0 behind on one of the finest goals in the tournament, and require two colossal blunders by match officials to survive and win out. Potter and a bunch of kids against the Pep and a bunch of supposedly world class players, superbly coached, with superior talent and athleticism. The competitive difference on any given day is a fine line and its not delivered and certainly not guaranteed by exuberant spending and the difference therein.

Competitive advantage, as in most industries, is delivered by professional management, talented people well led and coordinated, superior culture and innovation. Potter demonstrated that on the field. Clubs need to demonstrate that off the field.

 

[KVetch]

I really give up on the greed and stupidity of many football players - and some clubs are as bad as them. It seems now that players will NOT accept wage cuts only deferral of wages - which means they get paid anyway down the line. In other words, they give up fuck all. Thing is, clubs will lose a tremendous amount of money due to Covid and its after effects and many will not be able to afford the astronomical wages they have been paying.

Many clubs face extinction. FACT! Even some of the bigger clubs are threatened. Don't these idiot footballers understand that if a club fails they'll get fuck all, contract or no contract? It seems not because many are still demanding their money irrespective; rabidly backed by Gordon Taylor the highest paid Union official in the world earning £2.3 million per annum from arguably the smallest Union in the world.

Covid 19 is causing a world wide depression - not a recession but a full blown DEPRESSION the like of which no one will ever have experienced before. Money is going to be in short supply from the general public, the consumers. DOWN will go the demand for club kits and merchandise, match tickets, Sky/BT/television subscriptions etc etc etc. People will now, more than ever, have to focus on obtaining and paying for the essentials of life such as food, rent, mortgages, heating, fuel, clothing and family commitments and so on. As much as we all love football, it is NOT an essential, so the pipeline of seemingly never-ending cash flowing into football's coffers is quickly going to dry up. And the public, battling and scrapping to pay their bills each week, will become ever more resentful of pampered divas earning their lifetime wages in a couple of months or so.

Yet, what do I read today? Real Madrid are preparing a bid for Liverpool's Sadio Mane this summer. The price? Liverpool would expect to get £150 MILLION for the player and would then attempt to sign Kylian Mbappe to replace Mane by throwing ANOTHER £100 million on top making him worth £250 million!! Are they nuts?! Will they EVER learn????? Mbappe earns £400,000 A WEEK. Liverpool rationalise paying him this because they have a £100 million kit deal with Nike. But Nike aren't immune from the effects of a recession either and might well be forced to reconsider their position when customers, faced with paying essential bills and fighting to keep body and soul together, understandably might well balk at paying Nike £100 or more for a pair of fucking trainers!! Think about it.

Personally, I feel that the good times for players, agents and clubs are coming to an end and many good judges in the game seem to agree with this. Can't say I'm sorry because I'm not. It's about time the game was handed back where it belongs - to we the supporters.

And Nike still uses cheap Chinese labor to make those shoes and boots.

 

[KVetch]

There's no halfway house between me and former Palace owner, Simon Jordan - sometimes I think he talks utter bollocks: other times I think he makes enormous sense. However, his article in yesterday's Sun is one I'm in total agreement with. Here's an abridged version but the whole article is worth a read.

END PAY LUNACY: Clubs must seize back control from players and agents.

The Premier League has its greatest opportunity sine the 1992 Sky 'revolution' to rid a plague on its own house. And that is the disproportionate power and financial influence of players, agents and the union over the game.

Premier League clubs have now a clear vision of what happens if, say, a broadcaster took their money away. They have seen what happens when the finances disappear and, if that doesn't bring about changes, then they deserve all they get. The only thing that clubs can do to change the conditions surrounding the loss of all income is to reduce their biggest cost - player wages. Do that and they have got their answer.

Frankly, we're seeing football's backside right now - the embarrassment of begging players for help. Tragically clubs have paid players 'fuck off' money and they have repaid it by effectively telling the clubs to 'fuck off' in their hour of need. Players - who benefitted incredibly alongside managers and agents, from their clubs' abilities to negotiate huge money from broadcasters - were given 80% of it and most of them couldn't really care less about their own industry.

The PFA - funded by Premier League money obtained by threatening strike action - are now kicking up dust (Gordon Taylor) about players being 'put in corners' demanding that the clubs show accounts when even Blind Pew could see the revenue losses....... Football cannot ever allow itself to go cap in hand to the players. CHANGE MUST NOW COME AND IN A HURRY. [My caps] The industry needs to clean up its act. Here's my 5 point proposal.

1 Salary caps across leagues linked to turnover...........

2 The transfer market guide - a net allowance of 20% of the previous year's turnover on transfer spend.

3 The transfer window to be abolished specifically because of racheted-up January prices.......

4 Agents should only be able to act for one party - clubs or players. They should be reduced to 5% commission, and levies of between 3 to 5% on that commission to put another £15 million back into the football pyramid.

5 The PFA should be stripped of its £27 million-a-year GIFT from the Premier League after their divisive and destructive behaviour in this crisis. Instead it should be given to grassroots football.......

All this might be wishful thinking but it shouldn't be. It would give sanity and financial stability to the football industry. Alternatively, given what we've seen with the players, let's just allow the lunatics to continue to run the asylum.

Jordan makes a lot of sense and I'd love to see him as the football 'supremo' in this country. Common sense and fairness would reign for a change.

By the way, I wonder what our owners are making of this? I think they are seeing their investment about to come crashing down on their heads. What a shame!! I feel so sorry for them. I wonder if they are thinking about cutting their losses and doing a runner?

I like those suggestions, the 20% transfer cap on turnovee is a great idea. Should there be an exception for promoted clubs? That would hurt the Championship clubs joining the Premier.

 

[KVetch]

Clubs have had the power all along. They've chosen not to exercise it. A club has always been able to set the amount that they are willing to pay a player and his agent. There has never been a gun to their head. Likewise, the player has been to demand what they want and then choose to accept the offer ... or not. There's never been a gun to their head. And, with respect to agents, it is the clubs that accept the situation of paying the player's agent instead of the player. The clubs did not have to do that.

What has happened is that clubs, in a frantic effort to stay "competitive" (and I quote that term deliberately) have chased their "dream" like a drunken sailor chasing a hooker. If clubs had agreed among themselves to set a line and a limit, then they would have been in collusion and in violation of anti-trust. What was required was for executive management independently to prudently manage to budget and for owners to recognize, accept and operate within the inherent risk of the industry and its competitive structures. Financial Fair Play was a anaemic attempt to enforce that sort of management and operation. An attempt without vigilance, transparency, compliance and frankly the balls to enforce even the principal of it.

Now let's talk about the concept of "competitive". We all saw our FA Cup tie against City under Potter. We all saw one of the top team's in Europe kept at bay for the best part of 90 minutes, fall 2-0 behind on one of the finest goals in the tournament, and require two colossal blunders by match officials to survive and win out. Potter and a bunch of kids against the Pep and a bunch of supposedly world class players, superbly coached, with superior talent and athleticism. The competitive difference on any given day is a fine line and its not delivered and certainly not guaranteed by exuberant spending and the difference therein.

Competitive advantage, as in most industries, is delivered by professional management, talented people well led and coordinated, superior culture and innovation. Potter demonstrated that on the field. Clubs need to demonstrate that off the field.

I'm still mad about that match. Irate, that was biggest theft in the 21st century.

 

[Yankee_Jack]

I'm still mad about that match. Irate, that was biggest theft in the 21st century.

Our organization, coherence, and individual performances - Grimes was stellar - in the City match were superlative and night and day compared to what we have had this past season.

Where oh where did that Grimes go.

 

[ivoralljack]

Reading that Mezut Ozil and three other Arsenal players have rejected the club's proposal of a 12.5% cut in wages. Ozil earns circa £350k a week, so the poor bugger, advised by his agent, feels unable to cope on £306k a week. One thing is for sure: clubs in future will be VERY careful about the wages they pay and the terms of the contracts on offer. Player loyalty? What an effing JOKE!!!

Every sign indicates that the players with their greedy attitudes are digging a deeper and deeper hole for themselves. With any luck the era of huge transfer fees and obscene salaries is coming to an end. And football fans everywhere will be cheering from the rafters when it does.

 

[Jackflash]

Reading that Mezut Ozil and three other Arsenal players have rejected the club's proposal of a 12.5% cut in wages. Ozil earns circa £350k a week, so the poor bugger, advised by his agent, feels unable to cope on £306k a week. One thing is for sure: clubs in future will be VERY careful about the wages they pay and the terms of the contracts on offer. Player loyalty? What an effing JOKE!!!

Every sign indicates that the players with their greedy attitudes are digging a deeper and deeper hole for themselves. With any luck the era of huge transfer fees and obscene salaries is coming to an end. And football fans everywhere will be cheering from the rafters when it does.

He says he'd like his fellow players to respect his views. Forget your fellow players Ozil, make your views public and let your 60,000 plus fan base be your judge. They pay your wages.

 

[ivoralljack]

After slating Ozil for his mercenary stance about the proposed pay cut it's only right to point out that, amongst other charitable acts, I read that he has funded over a thousand operations for children across the world and helped feed 100,000 people in refugee camps in Turkey and Syria. So, fair play, a big well done to him for that.

 

[ivoralljack]

And fair play to Gareth Bale as well. Okay, earning £650k a week he can afford it but nonetheless he has donated £500k to the NHS and 500k in Euro to its Spanish equivalent in recognition of the time he has lived in Spain. Great gesture and well done to Gareth. Heart-warming to see much needed help being given to support the brilliant efforts being made by our truly wonderful nursing/medical community.

 

[ivoralljack]

Been reading and hearing all sorts recently much of which must have set the alarm bells ringing like demented banshees in the football industry. Seems that as many as 50 clubs could go to the wall in the wake of this virus and even some Premier League clubs are contemplating taking loans from venture capitalists in an effort to survive the fallout. Given the amount of debt they already owe the TV companies, this is indeed drastic news.

It might account for why so many footballers will only accept deferred wages as opposed to actual cuts in their salaries. For far too many years football has lived way beyond its means and this freak situation has caught many clubs out. Spend, spend, spend was the philosophy and most of their debt has been accumulated by paying hugely unrealistic transfer fees along with obscene salaries to players and megabucks payoffs to their agents.

There's no question that this gravy train will now come to a grinding halt, with the squeals of football boardrooms louder even than the squeals of the brakes that will now be applied to foolhardy spending. Even your average thicko player will have realised this by now and, if they haven't, you can be sure that their agents will have pointed it out to them. I think that players on contracts will fight tooth and nail to get what they can, even at the expense of their clubs' future because I doubt they will ever again have the same earning power in the future.

I can't say I'm sorry about this and have little sympathy with the clubs that fail as they have brought it on themselves. But I have enormous sympathy for the fans of those clubs. It's not their fault and all they are guilty of is supporting the club that they love, exactly as we do at the Swans. I just hope that we will not be one of those clubs who go to the wall but, with the owners we have, who can confidently say we won't?

 

[KVetch]

Is the FA going to let 50 clubs go under like they did with Bolton and Bury?

The top dogs could get stronger. I'm not an economics guru but I get the feeling that this is temporary and next year it will be business as usual. Big fish will spend and spend and the smaller clubs will try to keep up with them and no one learns a lesson. The losses will be put on the lowest common denominator like the fans and supporters.

 

[ivoralljack]

Is the FA going to let 50 clubs go under like they did with Bolton and Bury?

I don't think the FA can do much about it, tbh. The creditors of the clubs including banks etc will want their money and will have little inclination to advance more to clubs who are already overpaying their players. And the clubs will have precious little income until crowds are allowed to return, which looks like a long time in the future. Obviously this will affect the smaller clubs rather than those in the top two Divisions but even some of those might prove vulnerable.

 

[Yankee_Jack]

Is the FA going to let 50 clubs go under like they did with Bolton and Bury?

The top dogs could get stronger. I'm not an economics guru but I get the feeling that this is temporary and next year it will be business as usual. Big fish will spend and spend and the smaller clubs will try to keep up with them and no one learns a lesson. The losses will be put on the lowest common denominator like the fans and supporters.

They won’t have a choice. Too much capital required for all. FA probably has limited collateral to pledge for loans. And, can you imagine the furor if they tried to cherry pick between clubs. The unraveling and unwinding of the factored transfer fees risk network is going to be like a tsunami that could bankrupt the guarantors ... the EPL and the EFL. And with media companies not advancing a penny on the coming season nor refunding the “current” season, there is no backstop ... as they were the backstop “underwriting” the guarantees.